I don't know if this is the best location for this post, or if I didn't see an earlier post regarding this that is posted elsewhere, but do you remember when it appeared on the MTV Movie Awards that Johnny has a new tattoo on his left inner forearm?

On ohjohnny.net, there appears to be a photo of the new tattoo, and details regarding what it is.

If it's OK to post it here, it seems like it would be a good thing to include. Not knowing if it's OK, I'll just bring it to your attention so you can go and check it out. It's pretty cool actually.

-- carpediem

Thanks carpediem--we do have the info posted about the new tattoo here, some pics too :)

http://johnnydeppreads.com/index.php?showtopic=5789&st=90

-Donna

Thank you, Donna. I see it now.

I wonder what personal meanings people may have regarding Silence, Exile, and Cunning from James Joyce's A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man.

To me, "cunning" in James Joyce relates to learning to express oneself as an artist in a skillful way, by working hard, learning technique, and using one's intelligence to understand motivations and objectives.

Sounds good to me--- :) I also like the Silence/Exile bit as well-----

-Donna

Carpediem...please let me get back to you on this one. I hadn't thought this through.

carediem, if I remember correctly, James Joyce wrote A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man after leaving Ireland. In my opinion the following terms could mean:

Silence ~ to shut out the rhetoric.

Exile~to remove from that which conflicts with your ideals and prohibits you from fully developing yourself as an artist.

Cunning~I agree with you on your interpretation of cunning ~ "learning to express oneself as an artist in a skillful way, by working hard, learning technique, and using one's intelligence to understand motivations and objectives."


Christine M edited to add ~ this is my intrepretation and in no way should be considered JD's purpose for getting the tats.

I do love his new tattoo. :) Aswell as I love his others. :D

Has Johnny ever mentioned James Joyce before?

Wow, Christine. I really like those ideas.

It's interesting how Donleavy uses writing techniques that sometimes remind me of James Joyce -- stream of consciousness, first person narrative, multisensory descriptions, etc.

My understanding is that when Johnny gets a new tattoo, it has a very special personal meaning to him.

Regarding James Joyce's book, I believe that some people have said that "exile" for him related to going into exile from Ireland voluntarily, to the freer atmosphere of places such as Paris and Zurich.

It may be there are parallels in Johnny's life -- freedom to live a more private, natural life at his home in France, freedom from youthful emotional baggage that one may seek from family conflicts or issues, all while still loving his family and caring about connections to them, to his lifestyle when in Los Angeles or London, and to other voluntary commitments and responsibilities. Exile from that point of view can be a positive choice.

-- carpediem

carpediem @ June 10, 2008, 12:25 p.m.

carpediem, I agree with you here also. I believe the new tats (this is just my opinon) are another reminder to Johnny to stay true to self, and another "thing" to keep him grounded. I find it interesting that he has the tat as large as they are and that they are on his forearm; a place where he can see them often.

It has also crossed my mind if he and Mr. Donleavy had conversions about James Joyce. I find it all very admirable. :)

I think Johnny may have discussed Joyce with Donleavy as they are often compared with each other in literary circles(of course I don't have any concrete info. on this)

Since Joyce's novel was believed to be autobiographical, then I agree with the idea that the words are a journey not only of Joyce's life, but words that others can relate to as well. Joyce had to I do see the parallels there with Johnny's life journey as well.

-Donna

Thanks Christie M

Silence ~ to shut out the rhetoric.

Exile~to remove from that which conflicts with your ideals and prohibits you from fully developing yourself as an artist.

Cunning~I agree with you on your interpretation of cunning ~ "learning to express oneself as an artist in a skillful way, by working hard, learning technique, and using one's intelligence to understand motivations and objectives."

This is really cool I was trying to figure out what he had on his arm. And I only had abd shots to look at. :rolleyes:

One of the things people sometimes say about James Joyce is that because he was very musical, he used the sound of words to add to the meaning he was trying to express artistically. I can certainly see that element in Johnny's work as well.

I missed saying "thank you" to you earlier, so, :thanks .

Donna, to me it is logical that Johnny and Donleavy would have, and still may, discuss Joyce, but I have never heard nor seen anything either. Wouldn't it be great to hear an interview where Johnny talks about nothing but the books he reads? Any idea if he ever mentioned who his favorite writer is? I'm thinking I heard that it was Jack Kerouac, but for some reason I'm drawing a blank right now. :unsure:

You are welcome. :)

That's very interesting carpediem. I hadn't heard that about Joyce. And now that you mentioned it about Johnny, I can see that, too.

That's very interesting!
As a non native English speaker I (as well as some other fellow German JD fans) was puzzling over the meaning of "Cunning" in the connection with "Silence" and "Exile". I'm still not completely sure whether I really get all the meaning layers of "cunning". :unsure: A friend of mine interpretes it this way (I'm paraphrasing here): cunning might allude to the idea that the artist wears a duncecap which allows him to say/write/do unorthodox things in order to express himself. This explanation makes sense to me, too. But it seems that Joyce's words are open to interpretation to some extent anyway.

Christine, I agree. It seems he uses his tattoos like affirmations or mantras which you have to repeat frequently so that they can sink in properly.

~Whiteling

CUNNING

I looked it up and the best means to me is , SMART
and we all know Depp is very intelligent .

I think he has said that Jack Kerouac's On the Road is a favorite book for him.

My favorite writer changes from time to time, especially if I'm reading a particularly wonderful book at a time in my life when the book really affects how I feel or my thinking at that time. Maybe that experience happens to Johnny sometimes, and to others as well.

Thanks carpediem.

Thank you, 60somethingdepp fan, for taking the time to look it up. "Smart" fits perfectly and we all know (even though Johnny always plays his intelligence down) that he is infact quite smart.
I think I was a bit confused as cunning has some pretty negative connotations too (trickery, intrigue, slyness, deception).

I did a little additional research and would say now that Carpediem's interpretation of Joyce's understanding of cunning relates to the original, old meaning of the word (found following at the Online Etymology Dictionary)

cunning
circa 1325, present participle of cunnen "to know" (see can (v.)). Originally meaning "learned;" the sense of "skillfully deceitful" is probably 14 century.

crafty
Old English cræftig "strong, powerful," later "skillful," degenerating by circa 1205 to "cunning, sly."

(Sorry for nitpicking, but I find language and the meaning of words super interesting!)

~Whiteling

I think the original meanings "learned, strong, powerful and skillful" fit Johnny better than "skillfully deceitful, cunning, and sly". I'm going with the older interpretations. We all know Johnny hates deceit of any kind. I don't think he would have that tatooed on his arm.

Debbie

I'm trying to relate to the word "Silence" too, but it's much more difficult, at least for me! :)

I think "Silence" regarding James Joyce could refer to not involving oneself in nationalistic political issues. However, from an individual standpoint, it seems that it could also relate to listening instead of always talking, not saying anything instead of saying something one will regret, and other qualities of good character that stem from keeping one's silence when appropriate.

-- carpediem

carpediem, I have to agree with you. If you look at the period Joyce left Ireland and his reason for leaving (discontent with the Irish government & the Catholic church)his purpose of Silience was to not get involved with the politics, nor voice his thoughts on the topic (at least publicly). And if you think about it from a creative perspective, debating or getting caught up in the issues, whether its political or religious, the creative mind becomes hindered. Remaining silent and staying away from the rhetoric (arguments), a mind is free and able to explore its one creativity without influence.

In silence there is a freedom to move towards your own creativity.

I believe this is what Joyce wanted to do and why he left Ireland. He could not write the way he wanted to while under the influence of Ireland and the church.